About the Author

Honey's main interests are online dating, long distance dating, and long term relationships. She met her boyfriend on MySpace and they have been exclusive since their first date over three years ago. Currently they live in Tempe, Arizona. Honey graduated with her PhD in Composition and Rhetoric in May 2009. You can contact Honey via email here or online here.

Why Ladies Really Hate Players

In reading Lance’s response to Goot, I was forced to ask myself an unpleasant question: why do so many ladies out there hate “players” so much? Because an emotion or reaction like hate (or detest/dislike/despise/disapprove of, if you think hate is too strong of a word) can only be inspired in someone who is threatened by whatever caused the emotion. Generally we don’t admit this, and say things like “I feel sorry for them because…” or talk about karmic retribution or whatever. But, pretty much, saying that we hate players means that a) we think they’re onto something, and b) we’re afraid that they’re going to gain the upper hand with us. So a hatred of players generally revolves around fearing loss of control.

Fear 1. Players Don’t Play The Game. When it comes to dating, most of us imagine pretty much the same things, in the same order. Women may want political and economic equality, but they certainly don’t want equality in relationships–they want the upper hand. After all, most of the traditional rules of dating were designed to give the woman the advantage. One of the appeals of “nice guys” is that their responses are predictable: I talk to you and you buy me a drink.

cosmopolitan.jpg

(I’ll have a cosmo, please.)

If you approach dating this way, then a player is pretty scary because he’s a guy who makes his own decisions about social interactions, who can’t be manipulated by traditional notions of dating. Ladies often accuse fellas of “playing games,” but what they really mean is that he’s not playing their game, and if they’re not setting the rules they don’t want to play.

Lesson: Enjoy the Ride! It’s easy to conclude that if you don’t have the upper hand, then that must mean the other person is in control. And if manipulation’s all you’ve got, then yes, dating a player means the power dynamic is skewed in his favor. As a Virgo (we’re all about control), this one is a toughie for me, too. However, ask yourself:

  • What have traditional notions of dating really done for you? If they worked, wouldn’t you have found someone already?
  • Is being in complete control of the situation worth being alone? And if you do find a guy you can control completely, can you respect him enough to be happy?

Yes, a certain amount of dating is luck–there are a finite number of people you are compatible with. But if you’re not finding anyone, maybe the system is flawed. Pay attention to what players do and why it works, and then incorporate those strategies into your own repertoire. Approaching dating with a playful confidence will make you stand out from the crowd.

Fear 2. Players are hard to read. One of the side effects of predictability is having the guy tell you how amazing you are and how in love with you he is. Ladies sometimes use the amount and quality of compliments they receive to judge whether the relationship is working. If that’s how you roll, then it’s going to be very hard for you to date a player because they just aren’t going to spend every minute of your relationship reassuring you of things you should already know. Plus, their confidence doesn’t depend on compliments you give them, so you can’t use their insecurity against them.

Lesson: Confidence Comes From Within. Judging a relationship by compliments isn’t confidence, it’s vanity–and vanity, my friends, is really just a form of insecurity. Instead of asking yourself whether they compliment you enough, ask yourself whether they complement you enough. Are you a good fit? Do you enjoy some of the same interests and hobbies? As far as your own self-confidence, try learning something new or setting a goal and working toward it. Be proud of things you’ve worked to achieve (an advanced degree, learning to snowboard) rather than things you have no control over (like youth and beauty, which are both temporary).

What being a player is really about is the realization that you have to be in control of yourself because, let’s face it–yourself is the only thing you can control. You can’t make other people do or be anything that they don’t want to do or be, and vice versa. So stop worrying endlessly about who’s in control of who, trying to make someone fit your mold, or changing yourself to fit theirs. Why don’t you try making your life what you want and finding someone who fits in seamlessly?

  • http://honeyandlance.com/contact Lance

    Great post. One of my favorite subjects, naturally. I’d like to add a few points:

    * There’s a huge negative stigma attached to players/PUA’s/seducers/etc, and this is a reason why women initially balk at even the thought of a player. He’s perceived as a con man. What comes to mind first? Cheesy pickup lines. Skeezy characters from a movie. Maybe the weird, tall guy from The Pickup Artist. The reality is very different from the perception. Most guys who go out and run game are just regular dudes who decided to get better with women.

    * One fear is that players use manipulative tactics or psychological tricks to get women. Generally, this is not true. YES, tactics are involved, and a great deal of skill, but it’s not manipulative. You’re working within the system of human attraction to negotiate a connection. You’re leading a dance. And dancing is sexy.

    Most guys who play the game will generally find women who are also playing the game. You see a player at a bar who picks up a chick? She WANTS to be picked up. That’s why she went out. So, in sense, everyone’s a player whether you like it or not.

  • http://www.hotalphafemale.blogspot.com Hot Alpha Female

    As much as I would hate to admit it players do have a bad rep out there.

    Usually they are associated with emotionally retarded men who are incapable of having any sort of long term relationship with just one woman.

    Like I have said before. Usually there are just the two categories of the player and the nice guy.

    But what I also say, is there is a heck of a lot of gray in that aswell. Its not one or the other.

    Yes there are some guys out there that are just plain sleazy. But there are plenty more guys out there who maybe be classified as players, but really are great guys .. who really don’t deserve all that name badging.

    I think the key is not to be so quick to judge someone. Take some time to give more people a chance.

    Hot Alpha Female

    Hot Alpha Female’s last blog post..How David D Helped Me!

  • http://theseductionbible.com Mike Stoute

    HAF you’re are so right. There is a Grey area between player and confident guy who won’t settle. Unfortunately, if your over 28 and a good looking single guy, you are typically branded as a player.

    Great post Honey, sup Lance ;)

    Mike Stoute’s last blog post..How to Bounce a Girl to Another Location

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    Thanks, Lance, your insights are right on as usual.

    HAF–great comment! I think we’re both coming from the same direction as far as it’s better to get to know some one than it is to make assumptions. The main point I was trying to make with this post is that you shouldn’t be so focused on jockeying for position that you neglect to see the person for who he is. I think that if you’re confident in your life and the decisions that you’ve made, then no guy can “get the best” of you anyway, so why not relax and have fun?

    Mike, I appreciate your comment and totally agree–confident guys that ladies can’t control are typically branded “players.” That’s where the fear comes from. I think there’s enough in my life to control without worrying about someone else’s every move. So don’t settle! Wait until you find a lady as confident as you :-)

  • http://www.vcarded.com The Virgin

    It is so honestly refreshing to see a woman speak honestly on the subject as opposed to what average women typically say (a defense mechanism designed to throw men off). I’m definitely blogrolling you guys, look forward to seeing more.

    The Virgin’s last blog post..Childhood sweethearts

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  • http://www.theseductionbible.com Bobby Rio

    Its funny cause everyone always wants the upper hand… but everytime i have the upper hand or control I’m bored senseless.

    Bobby Rio’s last blog post..George Clooney’s Girlfriend Sara Larson is Sorority Girl Goodness

  • http://www.hotalphafemale.blogspot.com Hot Alpha Female

    I think the same applys to girls. They want to see if they can keep the upper hand and as soon as they have it, they lose complete interest.

    I think the only thing that keeps people attracted to each other is having that constant challenge of who controls the power. Thats what keeps the spark alive, the unpredictability of who really has the control.

    HAF

    Hot Alpha Female’s last blog post..Is There Anything Such As The Perfect Pick Up?

  • true

    I think the only thing that keeps people attracted to each other is having that constant challenge of who controls the power. Thats what keeps the spark alive, the unpredictability of who really has the control.

    hit the nail on the head. It’s a power struggle. Answering the age old question who controls the relationship a man or women. Of course it’s the person who is least intrested in having the relationship who has the most power in it.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    True, I’ve heard it said before that the person least interested in having the relationship has the most power (or, alternatively, the person who reveals the least has the most power, which is slightly different). I have to say I don’t think that’s a healthy relationship model.

    In my relationship, we are equally invested in staying with each other, but most issues are not a big deal to both of us. Whoever it’s a big deal for usually gets his/her way, and whoever doesn’t think it’s a big deal usually gives in.

    The actual person getting his or her way changes all the time, which does mean power is constantly shifting, but that’s due to the particular issue, not a power struggle in general. I don’t think I’d stay in a relationship where there was such a power struggle–my bf said to me today in an e-mail that we’re a team. We work together. Most of the time :-)

  • http://www.hotalphafemale.blogspot.com Hot Alpha Female

    Hey Honey,
    I do think that the constant power stuggle will not work as a healthy relationship model.

    It definately helps when you first start dating someone though, because it develops that interest. The eventually everyone needs to settle down a bit.

    While i love the idea of an absolutely equal relationship … like really i wish they existed.

    Unfortunately i dont think that they do. I mean someone always has a slight upper hand or more contorl in the relationship. Yes they support eahcother and what not .. but usually you can suss out which one is doing all the leading.

    Sometimes its the guy and sometimes its the girl.

    HAF

    Hot Alpha Female’s last blog post..Is There Anything Such As The Perfect Pick Up?

  • http://www.angeleyesdevilsmile.com Brad

    Hmmm… interesting convo about players.

    I wonder if women type casting certain men as “players” has more to due with the fact that the man went out and had fun with her (maybe the whole shebang), and determined through that interaction that she just wasn’t what he was looking for… and her ego needs consoling.

    So, instead of saying “Ah… it just didn’t work… must not have been a strong enough connection”… it’s “Yeah, that guy must be a player.”

    I’ve been called this many times throughout my life and every single time I can honestly say that I’ve never been the one to “run ass” on purpose.

    In fact, the interactions usually go like this:

    I go out or meet someone through my social network… person seems pretty cool, cool enough for me to want to get to know more of (in whatever way)… and then find out if there’s any connection and act accordingly.

    Of course, I’ve had plenty of instances where I lost interest in a woman because of something that came out of left field (weird sense of humor that I hadn’t noticed… etc) and pretty much immediately ejected.

    Out of all of the guys that I know that have active dating lives or that have been dubbed “players”… not one goes out and thinks:

    “Hey, let’s go out and find some unsuspecting women, take them home… and then never talk to them again…”

    Usually, it’s the “psycho” red flag vibe that tells our radar to get the f&^k out of dodge :)

    Brad’s last blog post..Sage Advice ? A Heartfelt Email From My Father

  • http://taoistbiker.wordpress.com Taoist Biker

    Okay, okay, I’ve finally had to do what I’ve intended for several days and read up on you guys a bit. You’ve both got very interesting arguments, even when I disagree with you. Blogrolled, most definitely. I only wish I had a little more time in the immediate future to wade in. Maybe in a few weeks. ;)

    Taoist Biker’s last blog post..Successful Relationships

  • Yawn

    WTF? Women hate players because they “play” with their emotions! They pretend to like them, they pretend to respect them, and then they jump their bones and never talk to them again. Players are LIARS and MANIPULATORS. That’s why women hate them: they hit and run when they’ve usually promised, or made the woman think, they’ll do anything but that.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    Someone you just met shouldn’t have a claim on your emotions, Yawn…
    .-= Honey´s last blog …A Recent E-mail Exchange: Or, I’ve Become the Cliche =-.

  • Chris

    Hey Yawn,

    Im sorry but you’ve got it wrong, the fact is in the dating scene, women usualy have the upper hand as women play the role of the chooser and men play the role of the chaser, so in a very real sense dating is a womens game (she likes to hold the aces). Now its a sad but true fact that the “nice” guys do finish last becouse they dont trigger a womans interest, the women will get bored and move on leaving the poor guy wondering why it all went wrong.

    Players or at least most guys accused of being players (myself for example) simply aim to change the rules of the womens game and put control in there hands (I carry my own deck of cards), now alot of women aren’t used to men playing with there games and as a result will often expose a mass of red flags which makes the guy run for the hills (no one likes playing 52 card pick up). Why? becouse we want to be with a women who can show self control as this is is usualy a strong sign that she has integrity and isn’t needy. which for me is the kinda women you want to be with…

    fact is if she gives it up the first night, shes bad news long term… p.s. most guys become “players” becouse they learn the hard way being mr nice just doesn’t work (I know i did), so if the girls dont like “players” you only have yourself to blame.

  • PLAYER HATER

    The reason why player’ s are so CONFIDENT is because they do it with feelings

  • Zero

    I’m only (17) and I’ve dated more women then is normal for my age average to be honest I like to date I like the challenge nothing more I look for that surge of energy I get from taking on women not only older women but women of all kinds it makes me feel good to complete a challenge and when I get bored with them I make them feel like there the winner by breaking up with me when in reality they just got played again

  • Naughty one

    Sorry to burst your bubble but your mother raised a pig and maybe she, your sisters, future daughters and any other female you love suffers equally to the woman you play”….you are a loser, u will get it in ten years

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