About the Author

Lance is an aspiring social artist based in Central Florida. His goal is to be a kickass dude, meet cool people, and generally dominate at life. He enjoys sports, surfing, socializing, reading and writing. You can contact Lance via email here or online here.

Seducing A Sagittarius Is A Big Pain In My Ass

In a couple of my recent posts I talked about how I met a really cool chick named Teri. We went on a first date, hit it off, made out at the end of the night, and then did a second meetup where she threw me a curveball. Since then we’ve been on one additional date that went really well. We’ve slept together, too. We were on hold for two weeks because she was out of town and I’ve maintained a connection with her via text and Facebook.

Sagittarius

Teri is a really great, high quality woman and I’d love to develop our connection into an actual relationship.

The thing is, because of her love style, I’ve been having a hard time moving us forward. She strikes me as being very cautious or possibly an inexperienced flirter. What happens is I’ll flirt with her and that flirtation will get dodged, ignored, or changed into a chick version of a neg (mild tease). For me, this is disconcerting because I’m really flirty and I feel it’s necessary to keep the attraction levels amped in the early stages of dating.

Here’s a sample exchange of ours over text message:

Her: …back was hurting from playing golf today.

Me: I see back and shoulder massages in your future. Get ready for a rubdown.

Her: You’re perverted. Or not. But I’ll email my massage therapist right now. [She actually has a regular massage therapist and it ain’t me]

In the above, she does a takeaway where she negs me by calling me perverted, then another takeaway where she says she’ll contact her therapist…another dude. My “rubdown” line was a little cheesy, but nothing too over-the-top. I mean, what’s a little goofing around over text message, right? What irks me is that she won’t simply say that she’s looking forward to seeing me or whatever it is I’m trying to flirt about.

Another clear cut example is if I text her with, “Hey, can’t wait to see you when you get back,” and I get a negative response. That’s happened and it’s annoying.

Her dodging my flirtation has the effect of killing my attraction. I’m tweaked because she slapped down my IOI, so then I ignore her by not texting or contacting her for the rest of the afternoon while my attraction recovers.

You’re thinking this is probably not a big deal and I’m reading into it too much. The problem is this type of exchange happens too frequently. I’d say for every 10 flirtations I fire off, I’ll get back one positive one back, with the rest either takeaways or completely neutral. That’s a bad ratio. You’re next thought might be, wow, maybe Teri isn’t attracted to me. Maybe she thinks I’m a douche. I’m well calibrated enough to know that we’re on the same page, and I know that the communication of attraction and affection is the issue here. Take my word for it.

What I did was a bunch of research. I’m love astrology and I really dig how our birth sign reveals who we are, particularly our love styles, so I looked up everything I could find on Sagittarian women and how to seduce a Sagittarius. I found some interesting results.

First result:

“Sagittarians love impulsiveness. Most of the time, they have no inhibitions and if you charm them the right way, they will be interested in having a more intimate connection with you. Stay confident. If you are negative in any way, Sagittarius will view it as a bad attitude and will lose interest quickly. Sex comes first for a Sagittarian, so be direct in how you approach them.”

Second Result, which was insightful:

“Sagittarius is a mutable fire sign symbolizing idealism and independence. Sagittarius loves to wander and travel…Don’t pin this open-minded Sagittarius down. Give her plenty of space to grow. Try to be a friend rather than a lover!
The dual sign Sagittarius has two distinct parts: the upper side is human (idealistic and philosophical), the lower part is animal (fun-loving). You must be willing to cope with both sides if you want to seduce Sagittarius.”

I found this tidbit on an astrology site specifically for woman, so the text refers to a Sag man, but I thought it was highly relevant:

“If you have ever dated the archer, you know he is good at dating, but he’s a little tricky to catch. Sagittarius is symbolized by the Centaur — half horse and half man — which clearly gives him the ability to remain independent and roam the planet like a wild stallion, only slowing down long enough for sexual conquests and many short-term relationships.”

BOOM. The common thread here is the dual nature of the Centaur (the human and the animal) and how Sags are super independent. I also saw on a couple of sources that Sags are cocky. This tells me that Teri will hang onto her singlehood and independence for MUCH longer than I would normally expect, and that all the takeaways and dodged flirtations are her natural way of keeping our connection from getting past a certain stage. Put another way, she’s keeping me from getting too boyfriendy too soon.

The unfortunate side affect is that her dodging my flirts is irksome and conflicts with my Gemini nature. I’m super flirty, I want to get close, and I use flirtations to maintain sexual tension. Without flirting, I’m an unhappy Gemini. Being clever and flirtatious is at the core of my being. So, as you can see, there’s a communication issue here.

My take is I have to be patient and let her move forward at a pace she’s comfortable with, even though that pace might feel unnatural to me. I’m also going to start communicating with her that she needs to step it up in her responses and her ability to flirt with me in order to make me happy. Even at this early stage of dating, some compromise has to take place.

Long term, I have no idea if a relationship is in the cards for us. It’s too early for that. But you know what? I’ll stick it out and see where it goes. I’m having a blast, the sex is great, and I’m learning about a new love style.

What You Can Take Away From This

A lot of seduction is based on pushing certain buttons and getting a reaction, especially in the very initial stages of attraction. That might get you to a certain point, but it breaks down completely after the first date or so. Basically, once you’ve started dating someone, you’ve entered into a “relationship,” and to advance that relationship requires a far more advanced skillset. Calibration becomes absolutely critical and you have to think strategically, where seduction is almost entirely tactical thinking.

Compromise also comes into play, whereas in pickup there is little compromise. Just like in a business relationship, expect a fair amount of negotiation to take place as you move towards an LTR.

What I recommend is, do your homework and learn about the person you’re dating. Go online and read some astrology and get insight on the different love styles. Ask questions directly but don’t freak them out because you want to know why your partner sucks at flirting. Never expect every person to have preferences that are aligned with your own when it comes to pacing, flirting, and relationship building. Everyone is unique. Importantly, you must expect to make adjustments or else you won’t get anywhere.

Also, it’s safe to assume that MOST people aren’t skilled at relationship building and that there are going to be mistakes. This is especially important for us dudes, because we’re generally ham-handed and non-intuitive about the stuff.

I think this becomes especially significant as we get older and more self-aware about our standards. It’s way too easy to write someone off because you don’t have automatic chemistry. Automatic chemistry is bullshit and only happens for the lucky 1%. For the other 99% of us, we have to think strategically and work with our partner to move forward.

  • http://www.worklovelife.com Holly Hoffman

    As a female Sag, maybe I can give you some insight. Yes, we’re very independent and want what we want, but don’t dismiss the intellect here. Your line was not only cheesy, but a little over-played. I can’t speak for every Sag out there, but for me, cornball lines don’t work. All I think is, “Ugh. Seriously? I’m trying to converse and you wanna throw that at me?” For Sags, intellectual conversation *is* the turn-on.

    Also, I’m a straight-shooter with my flirtation. Mixed messages, cheesy lines, even sometimes comments that are meant to build anticipation, are lost on me. I don’t like not knowing what your intentions are. If you wanna come over & fool around, sweet. Just tell me. My independent nature means I’m capable of building my own anticipation, thank you very much.

    Every time she responds negatively to one of your messages, I would stop using whatever type of message it was. Sounds like she’s trying to teach you what she responds to.
    .-= Holly Hoffman´s last blog …Your touted “workaholism” isn’t a badge of honor =-.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    Holly, I’ve actually noticed faint similarities between your style and Teri’s, although I’m extrapolating a lot. That makes a lot of sense and I’ve been adjusting my material to see what works and what doesn’t. You are correct, Teri is a straight shooter. I’ve been doing more things like future projection of travel/bonding and that’s gotten really good responses.

    A counterpoint, and the point of my post, was that BOTH parties need to make adjustments. It makes me happy to flirt the way that I flirt, because that’s who I am, cheesy or not. I’ll be more straight for her but she’s got to compromise and connect with me the way that I like. See?

    Most people don’t ever consider the other person’s style and a lot of conflict happens during that breakdown.

  • http://www.whatwashisname.blogspot.com E

    Sorry dude – I would say no matter her star sign, she’s just not that into you.

  • Me Thinks

    Yep, agree with E. I dated a guy and the interaction was similar, I just wasn’t that into him. He had some good qualities but he would get on my nerves busting out stuff like this, whereas with another guy, I’d probably enjoy it and flirt back.

    And no, I’m no Sagittarius.

    I think you have a few good points but are not seeing the forest for the trees.

    I disagree that chemistry doesn’t exist. When it does, you don’t have to work at it – you may have to work on the other stuff, but if you have real chemistry, maintaining attraction is the easy part.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    Negative, she’s attracted and wants to date. There’s a mass of information not in the post that clinches it. Don’t get stuck on my two examples.
    .-= Lance´s last blog …Seducing A Sagittarius Is A Big Pain In My Ass =-.

  • http://casualencounters.com/blog/ Janak

    Hah. Stopped reading at “I’m love astrology”.
    .-= Janak´s last blog …PlentyOfFish review =-.

  • Mr_Right

    You really believe all that astrology mumbo-jumbo?

  • glsurf

    Lance,

    Great series of posts and all of this is so true. I am jealous you’ve met a cool Sag. I’m a Leo and I click so naturally with Sag it’s not even funny. There are a few instances where chemistry is just there and you do have to work on the other stuff. If she keeps coming back, she’s into you, you know that.

    Good luck with it, dude.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    Yes. It works.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    Well, Lance, since you love astrology so much I will give you this recap of my weekend now (upcoming post will be a little different).

    An Aries picks a fight with a Virgo…
    .-= Honey´s last blog …Seducing A Sagittarius Is A Big Pain In My Ass =-.

  • http://frauleinsenorita.blogspot.com Sandra

    I found your blog at Dad’s House and I had to read because I am a female sagittarius as well.

    I read that geminis and Sagittarians can go either way, they can be real great together, or a total disaster.

    I agree with your first poster, Holly. You have to appeal to her brain before she will let you in her pants.

    I am an inexperienced flirter as well, and when a man throws me a line you threw at her, sometimes I don’t know how to respond. And when he keeps doing it ? I try to ignore it was said, which it sounds like she was doing.

    The massage lines are so cliche, every man uses them. If she acted like she ignored it, it’s probably because every man has fed that to her before.

    When a man talks about giving a great massage, to a woman it sounds like “Hey baby, how about we have sex.”

    Sorry to have to harp on you about the massage line, but think of something else.

    And good luck with your archer. Independence can be a good thing too, you have a lot of freedom to pursue your passions and hobbies.
    .-= Sandra ´s last blog …Hippy Love Dude By Ocean In Line to Fu** You……….. =-.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    My boyfriend would never give me a massage. Never. Or receive one. He hates them :-( Though he does buy me gift certificates so that I can get them “from” him, even if he’s not the one actually doing it!
    .-= Honey´s last blog …Interview with DJ Fuji, Lifestyle and Dating Coach =-.

  • http://engagement101mag.com Tiffany @ E101

    Can’t speak for Sags (Virgo here), but if a guy ever texted me something similar I would have texted back, “OK, now I’m scared…” I could never let a guy get away with such cheese-talk, so my natural reaction would be to respond with something sarcastic. Not everyone flirts the same way. Maybe you should try pulling back and trying a different method.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    Okay. So what I’m hearing is the line was pretty bad.
    .-= Lance´s last blog …Revelations, Part 1: The Weekend =-.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    Your line would have worked on me, Lance! But then, we have very similar flirting styles, I think. It’s the cusp-o-Leo in me :-)
    .-= Honey´s last blog …Revelations, Part 1: The Weekend =-.

  • kingmaker

    How do you reconcile your belief in astrology with the common-sense impossibility that the position of the sun and stars can have any effect on someone’s personality?

    Or do you mean that “it works” to get chicks in bed, but nothing more? ;)

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    I know it would have, babe. Some girls like a little sexual innuendo.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    I don’t pretend to understand it and it makes zero sense to my rationale mind, but I’ve found that it’s remarkably accurate and insightful. I recall reading the chapter on my Gemini birthday in The Birthday Book way back when: amzn.com/0670032611

    …and it blew my mind how specifically it described me. Every Gemini I’ve ever met has shared at least some major qualities that are described accurately by even the most amateurish of astrology websites and dozens of books. There’s something to it.

    I use astrology to make cold reads, which is essential to any pickup. Beyond that, I’m genuinely interested in the subject.

  • T

    I disagree about Sags not knowing how to flirt. I’m a female sag, and I adore quick witted conversations and flirting! If someone I was dating said that line (the rubdown one) to me, I’d probably say with a smile, “now you behave, Mr. Rubdown, or I’ll spank you” … but that’s assuming that I would want to flirt back and forth until I got that massage (and any option benefits that come with it).

  • http://www.mvastudios.com Michelle

    I’m a Sag woman and Teri’s reactions to your flirtatious texts have nothing to do with her being a Sag. She probably just isn’t like that. If I was really into someone I’d totally flirt back but some people aren’t comfortable with that. However, I have read many times that Sags & Gemini’s can have a fabulously hot connection. However, Sag’s are very down to earth as well and are very independent and spontaneous. If you really want to impress her, surprise her with a day road trip date somewhere nice (no idea where you live) and spoil her for the day.
    .-= Michelle´s last blog …YAY my new FLOR tiles came in =-.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Lance

    Michelle, that’s a great idea about the road trip. I might try that with the next girl.

    In retrospect, I think her deal is partially related to her Sag nature, and partly because she just has hangups with reaching out to her partner for whatever reasons.
    .-= Lance´s last blog …One Super Important Thing I Learned From Dating Three Chicks At Once =-.

  • http://honeyandlance.com Honey

    You could go to Lakeridge Winery…it’s only an hour or so outside the city.
    .-= Honey´s last blog …One Super Important Thing I Learned From Dating Three Chicks At Once =-.

  • G

    Hey, I am trying to date a sag now, and have been thinking a lot about these things. But my feeling from your story is that maybe she is seeing some other men too. I think there might be a chance for you, but I think saying things like the massage line are not the way to do it. She probably just wanted to talk for a little while. Try to see her as a friend first, and let her chose when the conversation turns sexual for a short time. After she falls in love with you, she would probably really appreciate a massage.

  • Christin

    This is not about astrology. This is about Venus and Mars. Honestly, you’ve dated her three times and have already slept with her? Women want romance, not sexual innuendos. Speak to her heart first, then you’ll have the rest of her anatomy. And yeah, the massage comment was cheesy. I would have given a rebuff, too. I’m a Sagittarius, but a woman first. Sex DOES NOT COME FIRST for me.

  • Lin

    Well, she might be like me, sag with cap moon or venus and mars in aquarius. I hate innuendos and XD half hidden intentions that are not so hidden, makes you seem like any other man. Either you come full or you start with talking first, friends and then lovers LTR later. I put men in categories. Those ones for marrying, those for having fun/sleeping/so on. And with those last ones, I wouldnt even text them much or expect anything, so I would kinda get sexual and disappear the moment I confirm you are not my type to have a long relationship. So why lose time with innuendo, i think to myself? Maybe she is still feeling you up.
    I also hate men who are too macho, with those cheese pick up lines. If you want to use a pick up line be innovative/cultural/unique. Only line that ever worked with me was some guy who in first day he met me, on a pub we were with some common friends, he hahaha wanted so much to have a date and I was acting like your Teri XD, he kneeled and recited a poem in italian. I kinda saw he didnt have normal sexual intentions only, cause of it, and I kinda gave him a chance and we were together as bf gf for some months. Then i responded sms and so on. But dont glue too much or call too much, specially if she has aquarius or capricorn as moon. She will get bored, think you have nothing better to do and only think of sex. Where is your mind XD ?
    Try to impress at first, to distinguish yourself from other men, with something unique, mental, philosophical, science, some hobby,dunno. Trying being spontaneous and not generic! If she said about the back in pain, you should have probabli said that your special sport, something you do like yoga, ballet, whatever activies, give you …. fil the line.
    Also, I hate men who brag and talk a lot about sex instead of doing it! I had a gemini boyfriend for 7 years. This talking and not doing of his made me crazy lol. Do first, talk later. Specially in the beginning. If you talk about sex, try to mix sex with something cultural, nature, point of view, ideas, so on. What attrackted me most on him was his unique self style when he was not hunting me or being too focused on me. :) Made him sexy and charming. Why dont you try it? XD Gemini are charming without wanting to! Specially when they dont want to. lol Usually Leo, Cancer and Scorpio are better trying to be sexy charming when they Want too. Gemini and Libra, air signs, they usually attrack me when they are not focusing on me. Dunno why XD
    I hope it helped!

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