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NicAre Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
By Honey on Mar 11, 2009 in Sex
I want to start this blog off by saying that Lance is a genius. Yesterday he posted a blog called What’s Wrong With Sleeping Your Way to the Top, and in addition to running on our site, it was picked as a full-length post for Brazen Careerist (As was my post last week, Top 10 Signs that You’ve Become an Adult. Check out the Brazen version here, as folks left all sorts of comments that aren’t on our site).
Anyway, one of the awesome and talkative commentors on Lance’s blog, Ulyana (check out her running blog here) and I got into a spirited exchange on the nature of prostitution. And I argued that stay-at-home moms are arguably prostitutes because their relationship with their husbands is based on the man’s ability to provide them with the stay-at-home lifestyle.
That’s right: I said stay-at-home moms are prostitutes. Boo-ya!
Now, to be fair to me, I wasn’t originally going to argue that stay-at-home moms are really just prostitutes. In a general response to Lance’s article, I said: Many (not all) wives trade sex for companionship, financial stability, and the opportunity to be stay-at-home moms. Lance didn’t bring this up and it’s probably not a lifestyle that a lot of people on this site are interested in, but millions (5.6 million as of the 2006 US Census) of women are stay-at-home moms. Every single one of those 5.6 million women traded sex for the opportunity to live that lifestyle, IMO. How is that different?
My original definition of prostitute was women (or men) who have no (or limited) education or job skills, who perform sexual acts for drugs or money in circumstances that are morally demeaning and physically dangerous, with no opportunity to escape that life or advance themselves as people. This is not a legal definition of prostitution, but my best approximation of such individuals’ lived experience.
Ulyana’s definition (which is based on the legal definition) is exchange of sex for goods or money. She makes the argument that opportunity (as used in Lance’s blog) is a “good” and that therefore exchanging sex for opportunity makes one a prostitute.
I’m not convinced that a career opportunity is considered a good in the legal sense, but it might be. However, if that’s the case, then by her definition, stay-at-home moms are all the more prostitutes because they are exchanging sex for the opportunity to stay home and raise their children. Ulyana argues that such decisions are about what’s best for the children – well, maybe. Sometimes. For some moms. For others (and I’ve met them) it is about never having to have a job, and if children are what they have to have to ensure that lifestyle, well – they’ll have them.
And even for the stay-at-home moms who are genuinely trying to provide a great life for their kids, the fact remains that one of their defining criteria in a partner/husband (i.e., the person that they would sleep with) was whether that person made enough money to afford the wife the opportunity to stay home and raise her children “right” (I don’t even know why these women are having children, but that’s another post). If the man wasn’t willing or able to provide that opportunity, she wouldn’t sleep with him/marry him.
Which leaves me with two final thoughts:
- Are stay-at-home moms really prostitutes? What about homemakers who don’t have children?
- My definition of prostitution isn’t looking so bad now, huh?
If this post made steam come out of your ears, leave me a comment! But before you do that, check out:
- Dirty Professor and Authority Game
- Why Ladies Really Hate Players
- Spitzer: Power, Sex, and Douchebaggery
- Was Losing My Virginity Worth It?
Honey, thanks for the shout-out!
As you know, I think that’s a stretch… I view raising kids as a job. Is having a job prostitution too?
Look forward to another great discussion… I’ll think on the topic.
Ulyana´s last blog post…I Feel It In My Fingers, I Feel It In My Toes
I’m really not understanding this argument. How is sex fit into the job description of being a stay at home mom? Presumably a stay at home mom has sex because she wants to, not because it is some kind of exchange for the fruits of her husband’s labor…
A stay at home mom has her own responsibilities. Someone does need to take care of the kids. If the mom works they will hire someone. Therefore being a stay at home mom is in and of itself a job, separate from sex.
Hammer´s last blog post…LR – 15 Minute Bathroom Pull
I’m not saying that sex is part of the job description of being a stay at home mom. What I’m saying is that these women are choosing their sexual partner based on the opportunity that person can give them.
I agree that raising a child is difficult, time consuming, and expensive. That’s why I never plan to have any!
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
It’s an interesting argument for sure. To be honest, I’d never thought of it those terms probably because being a stay-at-home mom was never something I envisioned for myself. While many women choose to do this, it was just never an option I considered. I suppose it could be viewed as you say. On the other hand, it really does seem to be a stretch.
lisaq´s last blog post…Sex and God-Is Sex Before Marriage Really Wrong?
So… your point is that IF you define prostitution the way Ulyana does then this is the logical conclusion BUT you personally do not define it this way? Sorry, but it sounds like you are just trying to make a controversial post to up your traffic.
Yes, some women’s dream is to have kids and stay at home with them and their life choices are motivated by that. Just like some men have a dream to have a wife and kids at home. Hell, some men do NOT want their wives working even if the wife wants to (ick). Personally I believe its more mutual than you think and that the % of women who just want to stay home and not work is pretty slim, I can’t imagine anyone thinking raising children is no work at all.
But you are missing the main reason people make these choices and it is nothing akin to prostituting yourself in order to stay home: Financial.
A substantial number of women do not make enough money to afford to work once they have kids. Trust me, most of these women would happily work and NOT stay at home but do not make enough money to do so.
Conversely, some women make TOO much money to justify staying home. Or depending on where you are at in your career it can be suicidal to take off more than your 12 weeks even if you want to stay home for a while and can afford it.
My point is that your assumption is that these are trading sex to avoid working (this sounds insane as I write it) but in real life these choices are made because of the huge gap in salary between genders. If there is ever a day when men and women earn equally it will be interesting to see what happens. I’d guess fewer parents of any gender would stay home full time.
Me Thinks, Aren’t all bloggers trying to get more traffic? The better question is why. I want more traffic in this instance because the more people read my blog and are motivated to comment, the more ideas and explanations I get on this issue, and the greater my opportunity to consider other people’s opinions and change my mind becomes. That’s why I blog, after all – I’m trying to figure out why the world works as it does and why people believe the things they do.
The reason I don’t buy the financial argument (at least not completely) is because having kids is a luxury, not a necessity (in fact, humanity/the environment would be better off if fewer people made that choice). So if your argument is that people are stay at home moms because that’s the only way they can afford their kids, my question becomes: why are people having children they can’t afford?
I never said anything about trading sex. In fact, I was pretty careful not to say any such thing. I was talking about choice in sexual partners. Also, yes you’re right – I personally don’t define prostitution in a way that puts stay at home moms in that category. I’m trying to figure out why other people do.
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
Oh, I’m not saying these people can’t afford their kids. I’m saying that working is not affordable. BIG difference. There is a tremendous financial benefit to one partner staying home and unfortunately the vast majority of the time it is women.
Ironically I just read this article, its a perfect example of what I’m saying with the financial dollars and sense behind it:
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2008/04/10/advice-from-the-top-marry-a-stay-at-home-spouse-or-buy-the-equivalent/
I’m not trying to blast on you. I get that you are encouraging an intelligent discussion but to spark a controversial debate espousing an opinion that is not yours seems illogical to me.
Me Thinks, Thanks, I’ll definitely check out that link!
As far as your last comment, I’m not sure how else I’m supposed to figure out how people different from me think. But I’m certainly open to suggestions!
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
The assumptions made in this post are so bizarre. I’ll just tell you my personal experience, which I believe is far closer to the norm than what you’re espousing here, and leave it at that.
I got married because I was in love. I chose to have sex with my (then) husband because I loved him and loved sex. We chose to have children. I never planned to stay home, but after the kids were born my desire to stay home and raise them myself was very strong and I chose to leave a career that paid well to do so.
Some friends that are stay-at-home moms knew prior to having kids that they wanted to stay home with them, but the beginning of their story is the same as mine. They didn’t get married just to “prostitute” themselves so they could stay home and not work. Some friends stay home because financially it makes no sense to work, considering daycare costs.
As was already mentioned, raising kids IS work. Hard, demanding, exhausting work. And it’s not cheap to pay someone else to do it. From what you wrote, it appears you imagine stay-at-home moms sitting around watching TV all day, and submitting to sex they don’t particularly want when their husbands get home from work. Like I said, bizarre.
Angie, thanks for your comment! This is really helpful. I do question your chronology a little bit as far as deciding to have children after getting married – are you saying you didn’t know that you wanted to have kids prior to meeting him and you never talked about it before getting married? Would you have fallen in love with your husband if he didn’t want kids (or couldn’t afford them)?
I think that moms work harder than anyone else, and it’s horrible and unfortunate that our society isn’t set up in a way that compensates them. As I said in other comments above, that’s why I consider the ability to stay home and raise your own kids a luxury. While I do admit that all the moms I know basically stopped wanting to have sex after they had their children, perhaps my sample is too limited. Do the majority of parents have active, fulfilling sex lives after they have children?
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
Correct… I was young (23) and I had no idea whether I wanted to have kids at the time I got married and was actually leaning towards no. He was open to it, but OK either way. A few years later we decided we wanted to. Had I known ahead of time that I for sure wanted kids, then yes I would have married someone who also knew for sure he wanted kids.
And at the time we married, we could not afford kids (and I think that’s pretty typical). But we both certainly had the potential to earn more in the years to come as our careers advanced. And as I mentioned above, I had no plans to be a stay-at-home mom, but it later became what I wanted to do. And I am thankful we were in a position to do it–certainly not all parents are or even want to.
As for the sex issue… While the first year after childbirth is hard (both physically and emotionally) I didn’t stop wanting or having sex with my husband after the kids were born. (I stopped when he became an alcoholic–we’re now divorced.) I can’t really speak to what the majority of parents’ sex lives are like.
Thanks so much for sharing, Angie! I think your perspective and experience is really interesting (and statistically unusual, at least the genuinely not knowing whether or not you wanted kids part). It sounds like you really thought about it and made a decision based on logic and your own personal circumstance, which is awesome.
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
This is a really tough perspective and certainly one that’s going to be unpopular. Props on going there.
My take is this. The word “prostitute” has a really negative connotation, similar to the word “whore,” and I would shy away from using it in most cases.
In the case of the girl who traded sex for guidance in the Amazon, I don’t in any way consider her a prostitute. I see that as two consenting adults who did what consenting adults do every day. They went on a trip. They had some sex. They traded value. Same with my trainer chick, she traded good times/sex for a blog. Is she a prostitute because she had sex with me? Heck no.
The fact is, there’s almost always a value exchange going on when two people have sex. Sometimes the value is homemaking, sometimes it’s “love,” sometimes it’s money, sometimes it’s just mutual pleasure. I think it’s all valid and you judge it depending on the context.
I think it’s perfectly honorable if a woman or man chooses to be a homemaker and I wouldn’t ever call it prostitution, even if it’s pretty clear that one partner is trading sex for security. I wouldn’t do it, but that’s me.
@Hammer: I agree, I think of homemaking as a job.
Lance´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
As someone with a degree in rhetoric, that’s EXACTLY what I’m interested in, Lance! Why do words like prostitute, judgement, and manipulate have negative connotations? Don’t we all participate in those activities all the time? (I’m going by the dictionary’s secondary definition of prostitute here, “to devote to corrupt or unworthy purposes,” rather than the primary/legal definition.)
How is it that we can say that when a person has multiple short-term sexual partners for money it’s prostitution, and when a person has a single long-term sexual partner for security it’s marriage? I’m STILL trying to wrap my head around what makes it different. Is it because Jesus says so? Is it because babies are adorable? Those arguments don’t sway me.
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
Honey, while its an interesting point, almost every stay-at-home Mom, and the stay-at-home Dad, that I know would kick you in the shins for saying this. Their view, and I include the working spouses in “their”, is that they chose each other based on a common vision. That vision being “one of us earns the money to keep a household and family, the other runs the household”. They all view it as a decision made by two people, not by one person.
I know you are not trying to cause controversy, but most of the stay-at-homes I know just don’t think of it as money for sex.
<<<>>>>
Chris, exactly! EVERY consenting adult out there chooses their sexual partners based on a shared vision. Sometimes that vision is money for sex, straight up (prostitution). Sometimes that vision is financial dependence for the opportunity to start a family. In both cases, the decision was made by two people.
So why do we denigrate one vision and venerate the other?
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
Ooops, I didn’t know there was a discussion here… need to check more often!
To answer your question, one vision is prostitution (and prostitution is baaad and we should not “venerate” it), and the other vision is not.
Say, if for whatever reason, this random guy I have no feelings toward and I agree that he pays me an allowance and gives me a roof over my head, but in exchange we have sex X amounts of time every day. THAT’s prostituion. BAD.
Or, like other readers said, you marry because you love each other. You have hot steamy sex because, errr, who doesn’t like sex. You make joint decisions, take care of your finances jointly. And most importantly, you are BEST friends. And then you decided to have kids together. (OR NOT). And then, say your husband hits it big, and you don’t have to work and you find that you passion is to take care of your house. Where in there did you become a prostitute?
Ulyana´s last blog post…Why I Like Athlete-Folk
The reason why I’m asking that is it looks like you are walking a very thin line between distinguishing what’s prostituion and calling every exchange prostituion.
Are stay-at-home moms just prostitutes? Um, NO. Are some prostitutes stay-at-home moms???? YES, SOMETIMES!
Ulyana´s last blog post…Why I Like Athlete-Folk
Just saw your latest response on Brazen. I really like how you participate in discussions. So many people get offended and start calling each other names. I referred to that in my latest blog post. And it’s also great to see someone being open to other’s opinions and changing their own. It’s hard to have good discussions with people who just cannot get off their high horse. So, props to you on that!
Ulyana´s last blog post…Why I Like Athlete-Folk
Glad you’re back, Ulyana! To respond to your points, kinda in order:
- Why is prostitution BAD?
- Dude a guy on craigslist totally offered me that exact setup when I was in grad school. I said no!
- That is one reason for marriage. Certainly not the only one or, unfortunately, even the most common. People get married for all sorts of reasons. Love is just one.
- I, too, am struggling with the line of when it’s prostitution and when it’s not. That’s part of the reason I enjoy this discussion! Is every exchange prostitution? Maybe…
- Thanks! (Or maybe I just should have called you a bitch. That would be HILARIOUS!)
Honey´s last blog post…Are Stay-At-Home Moms Really Just Prostitutes?
Honey, you make some interesting points. On first blush, I’d say that Stay-at-home-moms are not prostitutes because most aren’t trading sex for being taken care of. There is definitely a value exchange, like Lance points out. It goes both ways. The man provides, and the woman stays home to care for the kids. In that respect, she’s more of a servant. Or maybe she’s the queen, and he’s the servant. You could argue either way. The sex might happen or not in their relationship.
On the other hand, I had a girlfriend who was rockin’ in bed with a gorgeous body. The thing is, she’d only have rockin’ sex with me if I bought her things first. Now, THAT is truly trading sexual favors for monetary rewards. And THAT is prostitution. Even if she’s monogomous to me.
If a Stay at home mom explicitly trades sex in exchange for things she wants her husband to provide her, then sure, that aspect of their relationship is like prostitution.
Lance – in your case with the trainer, you could almost make the case that YOU were the prostitute. You exchanged services she craved and needed for something of value that she gave you! (Haha. It’s a stretch, I know. Today seems like a good stretching day.)
dadshouse´s last blog post…Three Mathematicians Go Into a Bar…
Dude, I feel like a prostitute sometimes.
Lance´s last blog post…Busy, Good Things
Best. Linkbait. EVURRR.
Janak´s last blog post…How to Find Sex: the Art of the One Night Stand – Part 15 “Having Sex”
What about the gal who goes home with a man for a one night stand after having him buy her drinks all night, or even dinner and a movie.
As far as the housewife, that’s way over the top for me. She has sex with him because it is the ultimate expression of her love. Children are, or at least should be, the ultimate gift to each other, formed and created together from that love. They then carry on that love after you are gone, and pass it on to the next generation. At least in a perfect World.
searchingwithin´s last blog post…TGIF – The Five Best Love and Relationships Articles From Around the Web – #1
If a woman is there solely as a sex provider, in return for financial reward and support – yep.
But a prostitute has no expectation of return business, isn’t there to enjoy herself/himself, isn’t committed to legal or ethical responsibility. A prostitute isn’t interested in the welfare of a temporary partner, beyond maintaining a business relationship.
A stay at home Mom is a mate, first and foremost. Loyal, depended on beyond sexual services. Her character and values are critical to the success of the family. And even your label – Mom, and At Home – bely the potrayal of her as primarily a sex provider.
I vote, “No!”
Brad K.´s last blog post…Are stay-at-home moms prostitutes?
you just want to justify the reason you are a whore, so that everyone else feels like one too. if a stay at home mom is a whore, where do you stop?. i guess you think everyone is a whore, whether they are in love or not. what about the moms that stay home, and take care of the children while their husbands go fuck around with registered whore in a real whore house. how about that for a stretch?. what the hell are you talking about. are you bored or are you just mad at yourself for being a whore in the first place, because it is said once a whore always a whore, and you cannot be anything else so like i said everyone else has to be a whore to make you feel better. try something else.
Phase One, what’s your definition of whore? I understand that your goal here is to make yourself feel better by making me feel bad, but I don’t feel bad because your argument doesn’t make any sense.
Obviously husbands who see actual whores have not only violated their relationships with their wives, but also their own (and their partners’) health. I don’t think I condoned that anywhere.
People who are in love and who make life decisions based on that love and their own compatibility obviously don’t fall into the category of whore, either. My point is that there are plenty of women who decide to marry a man who wants children, regardless of whether they want children themselves, in order to not have to have a regular job. I don’t think that’s fair to the husband or the children – in fact I think it’s pretty dispiccable.
So if you are disagreeing with me, then I guess you are arguing that it’s okay for women to have children they don’t love with men they are using for money?
Not for me, thanks! I work a regular 8-to-5 job and pay not only for my half of the bills, but also pay off my own debts. Since we are not going to have kids, all of our decisions will be made only with each others’ best interests in mind. A good life, if you ask me!
Honey´s last blog post…Can He Come Too Soon?
Honey, I can tell you don’t have kids because … parents (the stay at home kind or not) don’t have sex anymore! Or they do … just not with their spouse!
My first post on Honey and Lance!
Hi everyone.
Love the site. Love the topic.
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Who cares? For girls that label other girls being “prostitute” doesn’t release you from being a “whore”. Every girl is a whore. One is for money; other is for happiness; third may be just someone to pay her and her kids bills.
No offense ladies, you are smarter, better built sexy transcending gift to us. But you are all magnificent whores. So are the housewives, stay home moms, teenager girls, old girls…
All girls will agree with me; being a whore for that special guy that makes you pick your brains from the floor is absolute truth. Imagine stay home moms being whores for those guys that pay the rent. Who is more “just” a whore? Does it even matter.
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This is interesting, but I think that most guys would feel very differently about a woman who didn’t like sex but had it in order to financially exploit a man and avoid having a traditional day job, and a woman who is willing to do all sorts of kinky things because she adores who you are as a human being.
So the distinction is pretty huge.
Honey´s last blog …Lance’s 2010 Focus: Don’t Be A Douche
I don’t think stay at home mothers are prostitutes.
However, Honey, I do think your line of thought provides some good underlying food for thought for divorce laws to be updated.
It is one thing if kids who need support are involved or if somebody( male or female ) had become incapable of supporting themselves as a result of the marriage. For example, somebody who took time off from their career to raise the children, but who now can’t get a decent job because they have been out of things for too long.
However, when a person is awarded alimony/palimony and kids/support issues aren’t involved a case can be made that person essentially became a prostitute.
It essentially says that because that person had sex with the party they are entitled to be compensated.
beforewisdom´s last blog …” – but people have drank milk for centuries”